Poppy and the Steam Forum and Power Forum

Welcome to the steam and power forum, a bulletin board dedicated to questions and answers to Steam Plants and Power Generation Plants for steam boilers, turbine generator and heating problems. Dedicated to power plants, power generation, supercritical, and heating plants as well as steam boilers, steam turbine generators, gas turbines or combustion turbines, hrsg, steam heating, pressure vessels, steam line, including ASME questions and more. Remember the forum is made up of volunteers from experts to beginners. Unfortunately, we cannot allow free commercialism that promotes products, services, or sites.
 
The Steam Forum and Power Forum is being sponsored by the following:
Industrial Training School - Main Distant Learning
 

Poppy   Steam Forum  

High Sulfite Residual

Sunday, December 31, 2017   By: Freeman [2215] 0 Stars
Hi all,
We have two type boiler in our gas processing company, with the following condition:

1.High Pressure Boiler P36bar T320 C
Blowdown Water: pH10.5-11.5 TDS 500ppm PO430-50 ppm SO320-40 ppm

2. Waste Heat Recovery Boiler WHRB:P20 bar T214 C
Blowdown Water: pH10.5-11.5 TDS 300ppm PO430-60 ppm SO380-100 ppm

Sulfite is injetcted in DA reservoir tank. Although, the feed water of both boilers are the same ph8.3 TDS2ppm and cycle concentration in WHRB is lower than HP boiler but sulfite residual in WHRB are higher than High Pressure Boiler.

We re going to find out the reason of high sulfite residual in WHRB, could someone explain whats the reason of this phenomena? The standard limit for sulfite residual is 20-40 pmm, Is this high level sulfite residual in WHRB harmful?

Thanks in advance!





Post a Reply...
Viewed 371 times

Wednesday, January 03, 2018   By: Ross. [390] 5 Stars
First, I want to say that large amounts of Sodium Sulfite NaSO3 becomes a contaminate because it will produce foaming and other problems, but foaming is the primary problem.

Your 500-psi Water Tube Boiler is seems to have reasonable level of residual Sodium Sulfite NaSO3 remaining in the boiler water. Nice pH too.

Your 300-psi Waste Heat Recovery Boiler has twice what I would expect for Sodium Sulfite NaSO3 at ranging 80-ppm to 100-ppm. pH is good so you are getting a good yield.

As you probably know Sodium Sulfite NaSO3 does not decompose until around 1800-psi.

So, my thoughts are the 500-psi Water Tube Boiler has some troublesome contaminates that are consuming the Sodium Sulfite NaSO3. But I am assuming you are using the same Deaerator, FW Pumps and piping.

Hope this helps and Good Luck. Ross

Post a Reply...
Viewed 311 times

Wednesday, January 10, 2018   By: Freeman [2215] 0 Stars
Thanks for your helpful reply.

We have been investigating the reasons of this issue.

For boilers, the deaerator is the same but pumps are different. Steam turbine pumps are used for HP boiler and electrical driven pumps are used for WHRB. After investigation we see that after putting in service one more Steam turbine pump for HP boilers, sulfite residual increase again in WHRB.

Is that possible that air leakage happens in steam turbine pumps and consume sulfite ?

Thanks in advance for your helpful guide!

Post a Reply...
Viewed 281 times

Wednesday, January 10, 2018   By: Ross [390] 5 Stars
Maybe you could comment on the piping on the deaerator to the Feed Water Pumps. Does the FW Piping to the Steam Pumps draw DA water from a different outlet in the DA than the Waste Heat Recovery Boiler?

Ross

Post a Reply...
Viewed 275 times

Wednesday, January 10, 2018   By: Freeman [2215] 0 Stars
After DA, theres main header which suctions of steam pump and electrical pump are connected to it.

We measure the sulfite residual in HP and WHRB boilers twice a day and change the sulfite dosing pump stroke based on HP boiler result, we try to keep sulfite residula in HP boiler in range 20-30 ppm.
Recently after putting one more steam pump, we had to increase dosing pump stroke for keeping sulfite residula in HP boiler in range 20-30.

Post a Reply...
Viewed 283 times

Wednesday, January 10, 2018   By: Ross [390] 5 Stars
You may want to consider the waterside deposits in the 500-psi High Pressure Watertube Boiler is consuming the NaSO3.

You have a common NaSO3 injection pump into the DA Tank. All FW Pumps have common Inlet piping. The differences are the pumps, which seem reasonable to rule out. Then we are left with the discharge piping and boilers are the difference.

It is not a horrific spot to be in and maybe consider a more comprehensive waterside deposit investigation including the discharge piping wet surfaces.

Ross

Post a Reply...
Viewed 264 times

Wednesday, January 10, 2018   By: Jim Watts [764] 5 Stars
It now seems clear that the high sulfite in the WHB is caused by increasing dosing to suit extra demand on the High pressure Boiler.
With the coincidence of demand increasing with BFP pump operations the likely spotis the pumps.
Air cannot get into the pumps directly but there is a path in via gland sealing water.
Check the source of the gland cooling water and figure out a way to make sure no Air is being injected.

BTW I assume you do not have a spray attemperator as solids should not be injected at the DEA in such a case.

Post a Reply...
Viewed 274 times

Sunday, January 07, 2018   By: Jim Watts [764] 5 Stars
The most likely cause for having too much Sulfite is that you are pumping too much in.
However the numbers you present are inconsistent and difficult to diagnose confidently.
Your High pressure has the lowest reported chemicals but the highest TDS. This is probably because you are not neutralising the sample to remove OH alkalinity before measuring conductivity. as OH has 3 times the conductivity of other components the actual TDS may be lower than reported. You do not indicate the actual PH and each boiler could be at opposite ends of the range reported.
You sulfite units appear to be the result of different procedure as one is reported as SO320 and one as SO380 and who knows what mysteries that represents.
It is not clear if there is one DEA or two involved but it is hard to see two different tests required if only one is used.
Sulfite decomposition would be different at the different pressures and my be contributing to some of the issue.
It would make sense to me to reduce sulphite until you got nearer to the minimum on the HP boiler if they are in fact common feed and obvious if they are not.
Running high levels is a waste of money at minimum and tending to problems you dont need.
It is also normal to run the TDS in the high pressure boiler lower than the WHRB.

Post a Reply...
Viewed 299 times

Published on steamforum.com

 

Featured
Is Cp/Cv applicable to steam to calculate?
By: Kent mayhew [2161]

The reason that isobaric Cp heat capacity is greater than isometric Cv is that isobaric involves expansion. Remember our atmosphere has mass, so in order for a system to expand it must displace that mass. And this requires work. So Cp requires work plus the energy to heat the gas , while Cv only requires the energy to heat.

So for all gases and/or steam the work required to expand a given volume is the same that being the work required to displace our atmosphere by a given volume.

Hence t....   Read All
Advertising Info - Click Here!

It's hard not to look at this ad at least once, then you go to the next page an notice it again. Maybe you will not read the message, but you will be thinking about the brand and we call that brand impressions.

About 2/3 of internet traffic is useless traffic and consist of malicous-bad-robots.  However, there are good robots too.  We block bad-robots, and allow the good one's through, but we just do not count the good one's.  We want good straight-brand impressions for our advertisers!

Imagine your static or animated display advertisement placed here, and if that is not enough you can include text too to expound on the virtues of your services and or products.    In addition, you can benefit by using our new advertisement feature to have your video included in your ad space.  Wow, make an infomerical with text and a display by combining all features to enhance the readers or audience's experience using your brand.  Ads can be much more than a static display ad. Here is an example of how your video could be used or position in this ad space:

 

Caption: This public domain video shows from Nationawide Boiler and they are the first to provide a 1000-BHP trailer mobile rental unit using a Superior Boiler.  The author of the video is not an advertiser and is being used to show how the video ad can be of value to the reader since you have already being viewing the video.  It is hard not to think about the authors brand after viewing the video ad.  This is the benefit of Branding.

 

 

 

A Long-Game that Earns Tomorrow's Sales


Click on this Promotional Advertisement to Contact Us Today!

Good Branding Puts Your Brand or Company in the Front of a Decision-Maker’s Mind for a Purchase either Months from Now or Five-Years in the Future.

Good branding makes your brand or company the leader in a crowded field of other brands or companies vying for your potential or existing client's attention. 

An invitation to the buyer's table to negotiate potential sales from $thousands to $millions of dollars in any of these: Systems sale, Capital Equipment, Upgrades & Modifications,  Repairs, or Capital Project becomes easier now with a recognized brand that thinks forward by brand advertising.

Your advertising will cost you an unbelievable low amount, so ask for our Media Kit that has Specs and Rates. 

Below is some of our demographic data for steam and power forum users will speak for itself:

Bus Sector Percent   Education Percent
Manufacturing 11%   College 51%
Power Gen 20%   Grad School 20%
Chemical & Petroleum 15%      
Medical Facilities 6%      
Pulp & Paper / Forest 7%      
Pharmaceutical 7%      

Our network works hard for you with placements for full coverage on part of the network, or full network placement.  Brand yourself today and don’t miss-out on being invited to your client or future client's table because they forgot you.  Be the leader they will remember and be part of their capital project.  Tomorrow’s clients are your future.

 

Advertising and Marketing Agency for the steam and power forum
PE Marketing, LLC

Branding.jpg

Sponsors/Advertisers
Industrial Training School
 
Industrial Training School - Maintenance
 
Industrial Training School
 
National Assoc of Stationary Operating Engineers
 
Confidentiality, Disclaimer; Policy
STEAM and POWER FORUM
© 2001 to Steam Forum, All Rights Reserved.
PE Marketing LLC is representing the steamforum for advertising and marketing
Valid XHTML 1.0 Transitional